Defending the Doctrine of Universalism
What is Universalism? There are many opinions and views about Universalism but the general consensus is that Universalists believe that all will be saved. We use scriptures such as 1 Timothy 2:3-4, 1 Timothy 4:10, Romans 5:18, 1 John 2:2, 2 Peter 3:9, 1 Corinthians 15:22, Romans 11:32, Luke 3:6 and many others. All of these scriptures testify that God will save all of humanity but this idea is in direct contradiction with the teachings and dogmas of Christianity. Universalism is under attack and while there are many false ideas about universalism, I intend to defend the doctrine of universalism by explaining many of the misconceptions about universalism and refuting those who deny the fundamental truth that the salvation of all is in fact God’s will for humanity.
The Spiritual Terrorists of Christendumb
What is a spiritual terrorist? Any person that teaches and promotes the doctrine of hell in all of it’s varieties is indeed, a spiritual terrorist. Belief in hell alone does not make someone a spiritual terrorist but rather, it is the purposeful promotion of the doctrine in such a way that the intent is to provoke change through fear. Most believe in hell due to deception but those who endorse it are agents of the devil. There is no other group of people that promote the doctrine of hell more than the pastor’s of Christianity.
Christianity’s Most Scared Cow – The Doctrine of the Trinity
The Doctrine of the Trinity is one of Christianity’s greatest lies and it is the most useless and insignificant doctrine that Christianity places such a high emphasis on that it effectively makes you a heretic if you denounce it. The following is a critical review of Dr. Ray Pritchard’s article, “God in Three Persons: A Doctrine We Barely Understand”.
God’s Plan of Salvation for the Whole World
God is Sovereign and He has a plan to save the world that does not include torturing sinners. God knows what He is doing and there is nothing that is happening in the world that wasn’t foreordained by God. In this upcoming segment, I explain how God will ultimately lead all men into the knowledge of truth.
Exposing the Counterfeit Gospel of Christianity
The real gospel of Christ has been spiritually hijacked and replaced by the whole Christian church that doesn’t believe that Christ will save the whole world. In this post, I expose this counterfeit and reveal the true meaning of God’s good news of Jesus Christ.
The False Doctrine of Hell Exposed
The doctrine of hell is a terrible false doctrine of the Christian church that teaches and believes that God will literally torture people in real fire for all eternity if they die without Christ. I reveal the truth about this evil doctrine that continues to deceive millions.
The sinner’s prayer is an introduction to getting “saved” and becoming a Christian as it taught in the church. Other Christians believe that the sinner’s prayer is weak ultimately leading many to hell. Both are equally false because they both rely on man to save himself. Salvation is God’s work.
Does Man have an Immortal Soul?
Many believe that when a person dies, their soul continues to live on and either goes to heaven or hell. This belief is unscriptural and the bible teaches that when a man dies, he is dead with no thoughts, memories, or actions.
Satan: God’s Perfect Instrument of Evil
Satan is perceived to be the archenemy of God in the battle versus good and evil. What many fail to realize is that God as the Creator of all things also created Satan. There are many false teachings about Satan and his role in God’s ultimate plan to redeem all mankind to Himself. Satan was created by God to be the “Adversary”.
Context: The Truth about Scriptural Interpretation
The Christian church teaches that understanding the context of scripture is the best way to determine the meaning of scripture. This is man’s attempt at understanding God’s word without any spiritual enlightenment. God is the source of all wisdom and it is God that gives man the ability to understand his truths.
The Kingdom of Heaven & the Abode of God
If hell isn’t real, then what about heaven? The truth is that man’s carnal understanding of heaven is completely distorted. There is a difference between God’s kingdom of heaven and the abode of God. The bible teaches us that God is invisible and that no man has seen God except Christ. It is foolish to think that people go to “heaven” or the actual abode of God after death when Christ plainly reveals the truth about heaven.
The Real Gospel of Christ 
I just found your site and I have only read a little . . . it will take some time to read more. But I do have a question for you . . . are you familiar with a class called “Power for Abundant Living”? Many (not sure about “all”) of the topics you deal with are right in line with this class. I would be VERY surprised if you have never heard of it. Please feel free to email me if this post doesn’t make it to this comments section. 🙂 God bless you.
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Hi Jennifer, I received your comment but you won’t be able to see it posted in the comment section until I approve the comment because all comments go to moderation. This reduces the amount of spam messages I receive and only the messages I approve will show in the comment section. I have approved your comment so you should be able to see your comment section. If you have signed up to follow this blog, you should get notifications from WordPress for new articles that I publish and new comments made in the comment section. As to your second comment, I am assuming that it is a design issue with WordPress. All of my posts are actually not posts but pages that I have added over the years. Posts and pages have different attributes on WordPress. If I were to make an actual post, the post would show up on the main page and it would start a thread for others to comment on and/or follow. WordPress pages do not have this same attribute as it is more akin to a normal page that you would see on most websites. I designed this site to feel more like a website and not a blogsite. That is why I made the comment section so that people can interact with me and others. I hope this clears up any confusion you may have.
I have not heard of the class called, “Power of Abundant Living”. Could you provide a link so that I can check it out? I would be interested in reviewing the class to see what similarities we both have. Thanks for commenting.
Sulaiman
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Well, I received an email from WordPress but it makes no sense! The email says . . . “You recently signed up to follow one of my posts. This means once you confirm below, you will receive an email when new comments are posted.
To activate, click confirm below. If you believe this is an error, ignore this message and nothing more will happen.
Blog Name: The Real Gospel of Christ
Blog URL: http://therealgospelofchrist.com
Confirm Follow
When I click on “Confirm Follow” it takes me to another page that says – “Sorry, no posts match the real gospel of christ.”. And that is it! I cannot do anything else! I tried putting in a page title, your url . . . no matter what I put in – it says “sorry, no posts…..” I am usually pretty smart but I cannot figure this out. AND I want to figure it out because I would like to know the answer to my question to you above! thank you.
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I would like this to be a private message . . . please do not post on your site. I would like to tell you why I cannot send you a link to the class I mentioned above. I tried to respond to the email I received from you but the return address is a “no reply” address.
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Send to admin@therealgospelofchrist.com
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Tragically, present-day Christians have little understanding that the terminology, “THE LAKE OF FIRE” is simply a metaphor for God’s Spiritual Fire which is a refining Fire that purifies, not destroys.
Deuteronomy 4:24 – “The Lord thy God is a consuming fire.” Hebrews 12:29 – “For our God is a consuming fire.” Malachi 3:2 – “The Lord is like a refiner’s fire.”
By understanding these few facts below, hopefully it will lead to a better understanding of a number of questions that the reader may have.
John 6:44 clearly states that nobody can come to JESUS unless the Spirit of God draws them to JESUS. We did not come to JESUS on our own. We only came to JESUS because God’s Spirit drew us to JESUS.
There are billions of people who God’s Spirit never drew them to JESUS. God is not going to sentence billions of people to eternal torment and damnation who never even had the Spirit of God draw them to JESUS.
Even though God created multitude upon multitude of angels, GOD’S DEEP DESIRE WAS TO CREATE A SPECIAL CREATION (THE TRUE CHURCH) THAT WOULD BECOME HIS BRIDE. The past 6,000 years has been for the purpose of preparing a Bride (THE TRUE CHURCH) for CHRIST. God is a God of preparation.
At some point and time in the future, after JESUS and His Bride begin to rule and reign on the Earth, God’s Spirit will fall upon the rest of humanity who has ever lived from the beginning of creation, and will begin His transforming work in them which will restore them back to God (like Adam and Eve in the beginning of creation), and they will live in the Kingdom of God for eternity.
This is the “GOOD NEWS” of the GOSPEL OF CHRIST FOR ALL (NOT FOR JUST A FEW).
Once we have a good understanding of this part of God’s plan, much of what did not make much sense to us before, begins to cause the pieces of the puzzles to come together and solve what was once so difficult for us to understand.
I have written a 33 page document that goes into great detail. If anyone would like a copy, email me at: (candy33alan@aol.com) and I will email you a copy.,
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Thank you so much! I have long searched for these answers! The Modern Catholic and Christian doctrine that I was taught when I was young always made me question why an all loving God would damn their creation to eternal torture. It never made sense to me that once its done in life you are doomed for eternity.
Thank you again for clearing up the corruption of the Holy Lord’s Teachings. Many blessings and peace to you and your family!
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I have been banned from commenting on that particular youtube channel. It doesn’t really matter, what you believe really. God will judge rightfully. Jesus says, whoever adds or takes away from the scripture is cursed.
Here is something you took away:
The false prophet and the Antichrist will be thrown into the lake of fire for everlasting! torment. Revelation 19:20, 20:10. They are men like we are. Their followers will find the same fate obviously. So your doctrine fails here already. But that isn’t it yet.
Jesus says in Rev 21,8:But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (death = final destruction)
Then Jesus is asked in Luke 10,25-28:On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”“What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’”“You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”
So I recommend you to lay off this false doctrine that any person will go up into heaven. It will only backlash into your face. Jesus didn’t say such a thing.
Do this and you will live. Don’t do it and you won’t live.
Because what you are doing here is creating another Jesus. That’s why Jesus said, they will come to me and say: haven’t we done many miracles in your name, and he will say “I never knew you, depart from me, you evildoers.”
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So you think what you believe should matter more to me than what I believe? I seriously doubt that. You don’t have to agree with me or care what I believe but I also have that same right. God will judge rightfully so we agree there but that’s about as far as I’m willing to go after reading your terrible interpretation of scripture.
The false prophet is most certainly NOT a man and there are many “anti-Christ’s”. These are religious fantasies you believe because they tickle your ears. You have no clue what the lake of fire is but I’m sure you prefer that God torment most of the world in a literal lake of fire because you are moral idiot. People that go to the lake of fire will have their works tried by the fire just as Paul describes it in 1 Corinthians 3. You seriously have no spiritual understanding at all. I guess according to you Jesus has a literal sword coming out of His mouth and Death and Hades are literally riding on horses prepared for battle. This is clearly symbolic language and so is the lake of fire. Do you really believe that a fearful person deserves everlasting torment? Or that they should share the same punishment as a murderer? That is clearly a dishonest scale of justice which God says is an abomination (Proverbs 11:1). God doesn’t contradict Himself and that is why those who go to the lake of fire will have their part or rather PORTION which is clearly not everlasting torment. The word translated as torment is not torment as we understand the word today. This word is used to describe the torment someone might experience from a disease, being tossed by the waves at sea, the toiling from rowing a boat, or the pain from childbirth. God uses these experiences to teach character, to build humility, and to instruct in righteousness. Only an evil sadistic monster would do what you claim and it’s certainly not a characteristic of a God who is love. I pity people that think like you in such a reprobate way but what’s worse is you’re actually defending this trash. The second death is the death of “Adam”, the carnal man of flesh and sin that lives in all of us. When believers are baptized into Christ’s death, do they literally die? Of course they don’t literally die but something dies. What dies? The works of the flesh die and believers are no longer slaves to sin. They are a new creation. Do you know what brimstone is? Brimstone is an archaic word for sulphur but do you know why God includes brimstone in the lake of fire? Here is Dr. Strong’s definition of brimstone – divine incense, because burning brimstone was regarded as having power to purify, and to ward off disease. Why would God add an ingredient that’s meant to purify if His goal was to torment people forever? Maybe you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. God doesn’t judge to torment, He judges to refine.
Isaiah 48:10 Behold, I have refined you, but not as silver; I have tested you in the furnace of affliction.
I see you’re into bibliolatry since you think your preferred Bible translation is scripture but you are mistaken. There is no such thing as eternal life in scripture. I’ve talked about the true meaning of the Greek word aionios numerous times but people are so ignorant and lazy that they will continue repeating lies even after learning about the lie. The Jewish people knew about the age to come and that was the reference being made in Luke 10.
Before you start making recommendations, know what you’re talking about first because I have never stated that any person will go up to heaven. Jesus said that no one has ascended up to heaven but that hasn’t stopped foolish Christians from thinking they’ll go up to a heaven when they die. For someone trying pathetically hard to criticize another person you should focus more on checking yourself. You assume that “heaven” is synonymous with eternal life but you are wrong. The salvation of all has not to do with Christianity’s fairytale heaven. You clearly do not love God since you do nothing but blaspheme His name and you most assuredly do not love your neighbors. You despise your neighbors and want them to burn in hell for all eternity. You’re disgusting. Accusing me of creating another Jesus is just a reflection of your stupidity. Your favorite Bible translation is not Jesus. Do yourself a favor and try reading what I actually have written instead of making outlandish accusations. You might learn something but I doubt it. You’re too stiffnecked and in love with your precious Christian dogmas.
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All I can take from your answer is that you did not ask God in prayer but rather try to understand it for your own. God reveals the truth. The Pharasees did the same, they claimed to know God, but they never had a relationship with Him and did the things of the Devil. Deveice and slander. If you have a relationship with God, you will know these things. The human heart is deceitful, therefore you WILL be reading something into the scripture, that is not there, if you don’t seek out to God for revelation.
Lake of Fire is a real place, it is burning for real and souls will be there eternally. Ask God to clarify it to you. Don’t fight with me over it. I did not create all things.
Isaiah 43,4
Since you are precious and honored in my sight,
and because I love you,
I will give people in exchange for you,
nations in exchange for your life.
Jeremiah 6,16
Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.
Matthew 10,28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
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Frank, with all due respect, my relationship with God doesn’t include you and I don’t need your approval for how I live my life. You are out of line for speaking on my prayer life when that is none of your business. This forum IS specifically for discussing the content and for sharing ideas not evaluating other people’s prayer life. The insinuations you made are laughable in a sense but also ignorant because you clearly do not have a relationship with God as much as you think you do. You have a relationship with Churchianity.
You say that God reveals truth, which I agree with, but the truth clearly hasn’t been revealed to you if you think the lake of fire is a real place that is burning for real where souls will be there eternally. This is the most carnal and evil of interpretations a person can have and this is what you think of God? You no more have a relationship with God than a baboon does. It is mind blowing that a person can think they know God while also believing in a doctrine that is far beyond God’s nature in any context. You cannot impose your evil desire for souls to burn in the lake of fire for all eternity just because it makes you feel special. I addressed this in my comment to thatguy777 but you didn’t speak on a single argument I made. You just repeated commonly held themes within Christianity because you don’t have an ability to think for yourself.
You say the human heart is deceitful which it is but you don’t realize that it is your own deceitful heart that is causing you to believe in such a terrible teaching. It would be a gross evil to burn someone literally for 5 minutes let alone for all eternity. The devil himself couldn’t even devise something so wicked. Please tell me when you sought out God for revelation? Because if you did, you would KNOW that the lake of fire is merely a symbol with a much higher spiritual meaning. The fact that you don’t understand this tells me virtually everything I need to know about you. Everything you have accused me of you are guilty of committing yourself, which makes you a hypocrite. You do not have any spiritual understanding at all and cherry picking scriptures isn’t proof that you do.
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You are mistaken, and here is some real proof of hell. Take the time to watch these, I dont think it will be a waste. I don’t want people to burn in hell. God also doesn’t want it. That is why he warns people to repent from deadly sins.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1uEl6Fi9sQ&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=8&ab_channel=TouchingTheAfterlife
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9cSj1jFWU8&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=15&ab_channel=PRECIOUSTESTIMONIES
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18Os663dF0U&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=1&ab_channel=2031TruthChanneL
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9ymsoQXpvw&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=21&ab_channel=MikeKnoll
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N94InzLM_qk&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=19&ab_channel=AlmostFalse
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GY6MgfLIsPc&list=PLYV2wTPPIVhThYFs59sNIciVP6L7yT_yF&index=17&ab_channel=jamesjoseph
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You know the Antichrist will also think he is doing the right thing. Opposing the teachings of Jesus is the spirit of the Antichrist. But the Antichrist is also a person. The final form if you will. Whenever Jesus spoke in parabels, he cleared it up afterwards. The book of Revelation is not a parabel. There is no clearing up needed. Lake of fire is lake of fire. Second death is second death (after the physical death). The Antichrist is the Antichrist.
I can provide you some links that are literal proof for what I am saying. I tried to post them earlier, but I don’t think they came through.
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I just realized that you are both “thatguy777” and “Frank” since your comments are coming from the same email but I’m not sure why you have different names. The comment you posted with the links was received but it went to my spam folder. I have approved it and it is available in the comment section but I am not endorsing it. It is surprising to me that you give some much power to YouTube as if people can’t lie or be deceived in their videos. Just because there were enough to convince you does not meet the standard of what you call “literal proof”. Those videos are complete garbage and there isn’t a video on this planet that would ever convince me that God is going to torture the majority of humanity in a place called hell. I already know that hell is a false doctrine and that is why I spend hundreds of hours studying the topic before I wrote my series on the false doctrine of hell. I’m afraid you are mistaken and for someone that thinks hell is real, I can see why you believe all of the other Christian myths and fantasies.
It’s good that you don’t want people to burn in hell but the good news is, they won’t. Nobody will because hell does NOT exist. The idea of hell only exists in the minds of the deceived. Since you recommended that I watch those disgusting videos, why don’t you read my article on the false doctrine of hell? You might learn something and you might for the first time in your life, learn that our Creator is not the sadistic monster the Church has painted Him to be. Hell has never been a part of God’s judgment or punishment for sin. The wages of sin is DEATH, not eternal life in hell. Frank you don’t know what you’re talking about and your level of deception is troubling.
Repeating a lie over and over again will not somehow magically turn the lie into a truth. I am trying to help you but you do not seem to want the help. I am not merely speaking on my personal beliefs but from hours of study with multiple Bible translations in addition to Hebrew and Greek concordances. With that said, I can tell you with absolute certainty that there isn’t a single phrase in the original languages of scripture that says, “THE Antichrist”. This is a product of tradition a from Christian theologians inserting their religious bias into the scriptures. If you don’t believe me, go look it up for yourself;
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1jo/2/18/p0/t_conc_1161018
There is no “THE” as in “THE Antichrist” in the original Greek. There have always been “antichrist” among us or those that oppose Christ but there will never be this one man person called “THE ANTICHRIST” that will be the final form as you call it. That is nothing but Christian fantasy.
Why do you make comments that are not backed by scripture? When you do this, you disqualify EVERYTHING you say. You said, “Whenever Jesus spoke in parables, he cleared it up afterwards” but that is certainly NOT TRUE at all. Jesus spoke in parables to hide the meaning of his messages. He only explained them to the disciples and this is what He said;
Mark 4:10-11 But when He was alone, those around Him with the twelve asked Him about the parable. And He said to them, “To you it has been given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God; but to those who are outside, all things come in parables,
Jesus did not clear up all of His parables at least not the parables recorded in scripture. You said the book of Revelation is not a parable and I never said that it was but the book of Revelation is filled with metaphors and symbolic language. You say there is no clearing up needed but only a carnal minded person would say that which proves you have very little spiritual insight if any at all. If Revelation is not symbolic and is meant to be interpreted literally, explain to me why Jesus has a double-edged sword coming out of His mouth? Explain to me how people can inhabit the literal sea? Explain to me how Death and Hades can literally riding on horses? Frank, you don’t seem to know much of anything but you are a good at regurgitating religious dogma.
Hebrews 12:29 says God is a consuming fire so I guess God is a literal ball of fire according to you. Where is your spiritual mind? Jesus said that everyone will be salted with fire so do you have an explanation as to what that means? The lake of fire is a SYMBOL, it is NOT a literal lake of fire. The second death is not a literal second death either. The Apostle Paul said he died daily so I guess he had an infinite amount of lives until he decided to die for good. You are saying things based solely on your emotional connection to the myths and fantasies you believe. There are many “antichrist” or people that oppose Christ of which you are included. Anyone that endorses hell is an opponent of Christ but what does that mean to you? Nothing, you will continue to walk in ignorance even when challenged to study to show yourself approved.
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Great post!
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Lol…
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Listen brother, I do not claim knowledge. It comes from above and I was asking God sincerely about this topic and I was led to these videos and also to you for that matter. You want to tell me, God does not work that way?
The Sword that comes out of Jesus’ mouth is a sword that devides truth from lie. Rightous from wicked. Jesus’ tongue is literally a sword when it comes to spiritual things. It is actually the only sword that can precisely devide these things.
That is why he is taken serious, when it comes to him saying, the antichrist and false prophet and evildoers will be tormented day and night. There is no room for interpretation. He would not leave millions of christian believing that someone somewhere will be tortured day and night forever and ever, when He does not mean it. This isn’t just some doctrine. It is written.
To his people, his chosen ones, those who seek him, he always reveals the truth. And now I give you a crucial verse from that book.
Rev. 22:18:“I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.“
This verse definitely underlines, that these words spoken in this book are final. He gave this prophecy only to John, and if there was more to say, he would tell John, and John would’ve told us. There are a ton of false preachers, who do add more meaning and you think God will not stick to his word? That he will give from the tree of life although he said he will not?
Do you really want to go that route in your believe?
Please, for the love of your soul, repent, and also warn your followers, that you were mistaken.
Btw. lake of fire would be a bad choice of words for a metaphorical fire, and Jesus never chose his words badly.
Both the first and the second death are literal. The first death is the death of the body. The second death is the death of the soul. But souls are eternal so it is a concious eternal state of absolute pain. (Anti-life if you will, see Matthew 25,28-30)
The death that Paul described was the death of the flesh, not the body (because the body is the temple). Flesh meaning the nature of the sinful man. The nature that we abandoned, when we let Jesus govern our lives. This nature of the flesh, wants to come back everyday and has to die everyday, so that the spirit of God can dwell in us continuously.
This is the correct meaning of these scriptures.
I heard of a lot of people who came to Christ out of fear of hell. They knew for sure, that they would definitely continue to sin, if there was no hell, because they were just so entangled with sin. But the FEAR OF GOD was put in them. Good thing, saved them.
God bless, hope this clears it up for you and your followers.
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Let me ask you a question… Did you already have some understanding of hell and eternal torment before you asked God for knowledge on this topic? I asking because people often make the mistake of asking God to approve their own confirmation bias. If you are unfamiliar with the term, confirmation bias is when we already have a conclusion and we seek out support to justify what we have already concluded. So many people who believe in hell will ask God for confirmation and once they get that supposed confirmation (either from YouTube videos or whatever other source outside of “scripture”), they believe the confirmation came from God. This is an easy trap that people fall victim to because we live in a world where information is readily available to us unlike how things were thousands of years ago. I would caution you my friend and I admonish you to truly search your mind and heart to think about how ridiculous and evil the doctrine of hell is. I welcome you to read my article on the false doctrine of hell where I dive into the Hebrew and Greek as well tackling some of Christianity’s proof texts that they use to justify their dogmas. I believe in all honesty that you are sincere in your quest for truth but do not allow yourself to so easily misled simply because of some YouTube videos you watched. Hell is a monstrous lie and it continues to deceive people all while distorting the God’s character.
I know what the sword is that comes out of the mouth of Christ. That was not an inquiry. I was merely demonstrating to you that the book of Revelation is in fact filled with symbols and metaphors so to assume that the lake of fire is literal as opposed to symbolic goes against the style of the whole book. You yourself admitted in your comment that Jesus’s tongue is literally a sword when it comes to “spiritual things” but then you think the book of Revelation is supposed to be interpreted literally? That’s a contradiction. When it comes to some of the scriptures in the book of Revelation, it’s not so much about interpretation than it is word usage and I tried to explain this to you. You have to study how words are used in scripture. In the scripture you paraphrased, the word translated as “torment” in the Greek is not torment how we understand the word today. The original scriptures that were penned by holy men under the inspiration of God was written in Hebrew, some Aramaic, and Greek which were the modern languages at the times these books and letters were written. Many of the Bible translations that we have today were translated under the inspiration of the religious authority of the Catholic Church. That fact alone doesn’t disqualify “Bibles” in general but a diligent truth seeker should be willing to investigate the Hebrew and the Greek to show themselves approved. So what you see on the surface in the Bibles we have today might not be exactly what God said and if we claim to be believers in God, then we must be willing to test our own knowledge even if it challenges the Church or our worldviews. In my experience, most people are just too lazy to do this and they end up making an idol out of the very Bibles they believe are the infallible words of God. Bibles are fine but we have to understand that they are translations and not every Bible translation that exists is not as honest to the original Hebrew and Greek as others. The scriptures you’ve quoted in the book of Revelation are good examples of what I’m referring to so I will show you what I’m talking about. In Revelation 14:11, the word torment is translated from the Greek word “basanizō” and the literal definition is
a testing by the touchstone, which is a black siliceous stone used to test the purity of gold or silver by the colour of the streak produced on it by rubbing it with either metal. I’ve already explained this to you but I’ll go a little further to add that this same word is found in other scriptures so we can learn more about a words true meaning by learning about how God used the same word in other scriptures. This “torment” that you speak about is described in other scriptures as the torment from diseases, being tossed by the waves at sea, the toiling from rowing a boat, and the pain from childbirth. These are all experiences that we can relate to even in our lives today but God never used this word to describe being tormented in literal fire. That is demonic and I think your attitude and perspective speaks more about the condition of your heart than you might realize. I say that with no disrespect but your stubborn stance in clinging to these evil ideas is in direct opposition to the complete work of Christ for all of God’s creation. The false prophet, those who oppose Christ, and evildoers will have their works tested in the fire but the purpose of God’s fire is to refine and not to torture. So this is not about interpretation, this is about correcting the corrupt translations we have and letting the word of God speak for itself without the falsehoods forced upon us by the Church. It is a mistake to assume what God’s intentions are just because it might satisfy your own individual lust for vengeance. Revelation 12:9 tells us that the devil deceives the whole world so let that sink in for a moment before you make suggestions about what God would or wouldn’t do. The whole world cannot be deceived unless there is ample room for such a level of deception to occur and nobody can choose to come out of the devil’s deception. God must call them out of the devil’s deception.
I agree that God reveals the truth to His people, His chosen ones who seek Him but that begs the question as to who are God’s chosen… I wouldn’t be so arrogant to make such a boast when neither of us have finished the race so let’s leave the ego stroking for another day. Your use of Revelation 22:18 is ironic seeing that you agree with the translators that added to the prophecy of God’s scroll but you see no need to correct yourself. Promoting a lie even in ignorance is still promoting a lie but even so, I see no eternal sentence in that scripture in the way that you do because I compare scripture with scripture. There will be many that will be denied entrance into the kingdom but God has never made that an eternal outcome for in the verse right before Revelation 22:18, God says this;
And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
You see, you only quote the scriptures that seem scary. You seem to only have a gloom and doom perspective when it comes to the things of God buy you clearly do not know God. You know religion and that makes sense because religion has always been about fear and control. You are locked in that same spirit of fear and control and you don’t even see it because the devil’s deception is strong. Just so you know this, the word “ANY” which you placed in bold formatting is NOT in the original Greek scriptures. So this word was ADDED to the words of that prophecy and you are cosigning it. Think about that for a moment. Anyone can open Bible and recite scriptures but have you done any real study? By your own words you condemn yourself but you do that out of ignorance. You don’t seem to have any spiritual insight at all and that is unfortunate because you seem to want some version of truth but only if it aligns with your preferred biblical ideas. Your preferred biblical ideas aren’t in line with the whole of God’s truth and that is where you err. Even in Matthew 21:31, Jesus said that tax collectors and prostitutes would enter the kingdom of God before the chief priests and elders so that doesn’t bode well with your doom and gloom version of God’s gospel. There are things you just don’t understand and you will never understand until you humble yourself enough to recognize that you could be wrong. You could be deceived and I’ve caught you in numerous contradictions that you don’t seem to care about at all. You contradicting yourself should be an obvious clue that you might be misinformed. Do you know what a tax collector was back in the days of Christ? They were also called publican but they were seen as traitors by the Jews. Essentially they were Jews who collected taxes from Jewish people on behalf of the Roman Emperor. In Dr. Strong’s Concordance of the Bible, he expands on the explanation of a tax collector as follows;
The tax collectors were as a class, detested not only by the Jews, but by other nations also, both on account of their employment and of the harshness, greed, and deception, with which they did their job.
So in consideration of your views, can you explain to me how a person such as a tax collector could ever make into God’s kingdom? What about prostitutes?
Revelation 21:8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
Would you consider a prostitute to be sexually immoral? I think you would and according to Revelation 21:8, prostitutes go to the lake of fire which is the second death so explain to me Frank, how a prostitute can enter the kingdom of God according to the words of Christ in Matthew 21:31? This is exactly what I’m talking about about. You have a one-way Frank’s way mentality when you clearly aren’t as clear about your beliefs as you think you are. You don’t really know what you’re talking about your just throwing scriptures at me with no real understanding of hardly anything. Your beliefs are fear based while my beliefs are love based. Your message robs people of hope where mine gives people hope. Sure there are a ton a false preachers who add more meaning to God’s word but these false preachers are who you believe. That’s what’s so crazy about your words because you don’t even see how you indict yourself. You accuse me of things out of your own ignorance because you don’t even know what you’re implying but your ignorance won’t save you from judgment. In all seriousness, you need not tell another person for the rest of your life to repent when you yourself have not cleaned out your own house. I never tell people to repent because the Lord has already made that command but repentance is a process. Anyone that believes they have conquered sin in this life is a liar. You are in no position to cast judgment. And just for the record, I don’t have followers, not in the sense that you mean but I will continue to proclaim the glorious gospel of Christ that brings salvation to all humanity. The salvation of all is God’s desire and God proclaims that He will accomplish His every desire. What do you do with that? How can you argue against that? You can’t and the only thing you can do is lie or twist the scriptures to fit your narrative.
The lake of fire or actually pool or pond of fire is exactly what God intended to say so that there could be a clear distinction between those who are spiritually minded and those who are carnally minded. You are carnally minded clearly because you don’t have any spiritual understanding at all. The reason why you don’t understand is because you just read words off of a page and you think that gives you knowledge but that’s not how knowledge is acquired. Knowledge is acquired by embracing truth and as you learn new truths, your knowledge expands. Your knowledge can’t expand because have too much garbage in the way. You prove my point in your next statement about the first and second death. You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. The first and second death are literal in what sense? You mean as in the cessation of life? Your logic is extremely incoherent. The first death is not the death of the body, the first death is the first death. Death is the opposite of life not a change in location. The second death is not the death of the soul because the soul is not a part of a person. People are souls. Notice in Genesis when God created man, He formed man from the dust of the earth and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living soul. So the body plus life equals a living soul. We don’t have a soul, we are souls and the soul that sins, it shall DIE (Ezekiel 18:20)! Souls are not eternal and there is no scripture that says such. That’s why you didn’t include one and you want to talk to me about adding to the word of God? You are one confused person because you went from scripture even with bad understanding to just throwing out a bunch of religious nonsense that has no scriptural support. I’m sure why you quoted Matthew 25:28-30 but I’m sure it was more of your fear mongering nonsense. I know what Paul was referring to when he said he died daily. Geez Frank chill… Do you always answer rhetorical questions? You totally missed my points where I tried to show you how you contradict yourself because none of your interpretations are the correct meaning of the scriptures you quoted.
If a person has to love God out of a fear for hell, do they really love God or are they just being obedient because of their fear?
1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.
It is the goodness of God that leads to repentance not the fear of hell. No one comes to Christ out of a fear of hell, people go to Christianity’s version of Christ which is not Christ at all. Christianity doesn’t own Christ nor does it have a patent on truth. Hell has never led anyone to true repentance because they will always be a slave to fear and fear is not a fruit of the spirit. Fearing God has to do with honoring and respecting God not cowering in fear like God is the boogie man. Remember that the fearful also go to the lake of fire second death so just keep that in mind before you send me another comment filled with contradictions and inconsistencies. The only thing you’ve cleared up for me is that you are on another spectrum of deception that I’ve never encountered before. You have a lot of work to do because you are going to wake up on the wrong side of judgment where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
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I heard and read about it way earlier and also understood the concept but after I had my own demonic + holy vision/dream I asked God to clear and seal it up for me. That is the way to go. Because he will clear it up. He does not disappoint.
I will just quote some of your statements, to show you, that you are indeed mistaken:
you say “truly search your mind and heart” but the word says
(Jeremia 17:9) The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
“allow yourself to so easily misled simply because of some YouTube videos you watched“
(Jakob 1,5) If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
“but then you think the book of Revelation is supposed to be interpreted literally?“
Stick with spiritually. The lake of fire is a place of eternal spiritual death. Forever. Jesus doesn’t say that you can get out of it. You added that.
“This “torment” that you speak about is described in other scriptures as the torment from diseases, being tossed by the waves at sea, the toiling from rowing a boat, and the pain from childbirth.“
Yeah, now imagine this forever. The realisation that it will be forever with no way back, is the worst part about it anyway. Be it literal fire or not.
“purpose of God’s fire is to refine and not to torture“
Yup, that is correct. That is also why people in hell will bow down to Jesus. Because they will have to acknoledge who is in charge and also will they not be able to exalt themselves above him anymore. The fire refines them forever. But they will not get out of there, because ones they would get out, and this is my understanding, they would imediately turn away from God again, because in their whole lifetime they rejected him and they will reject him again, if they get another chance. Therefore they have to stay there eternally, to glorify his name.
(Revelation 14,11) 9 “A third angel followed them and said in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives its mark on their forehead or on their hand, 10 they, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever. There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”
“unless there is ample room for such a level of deception to occur and nobody can choose to come out of the devil’s deception“
This ample room is distancing oneself away from God.
(Jakob 4,8) “Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you.”
(Mathew 7,8) 8“ “For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.”
There three things have to be done. In prayer.
“that doesn’t bode well with your doom and gloom version“
It actually does, everyone who accept Jesus as Lord and Savior will enter. The worst sinners are often the first to accept it.
“you will never understand until you humble yourself enough to recognize that you could be wrong.“
I already did that, that is why I point to the importance of prayer. You seem to not really like that hint, since you talk more about finding out instead of letting it be revealed. But that is not how it works. There are many Islamic scholars, who are freaking smart, but they still don’t have the truth.
“So in consideration of your views, can you explain to me how a person such as a tax collector could ever make into God’s kingdom? What about prostitutes?“
Seeing you asking this question, I see, that you haven’t understood where I come from. The answer is two quotes above.
“I never tell people to repent“
Then you are cursed, because this is what Jesus did, and he is the way.
“You are in no position to cast judgment“
I didn’t, I told you to repent, it is not the same. Did Jesus judge the sinner, when he told them to repent? No, he did not.
“The salvation of all is God’s desire and God proclaims that He will accomplish His every desire.“
Please give me the exact scripture.
“The only thing you’ve cleared up for me is that you are on another spectrum of deception that I’ve never encountered before“
This is exactly what the Pharasees would say to Jesus, since they said similar things.
“You have a lot of work to do because you are going to wake up on the wrong side of judgment where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.“
You could’ve saved me all that reading, and just admit, that you believe in that place.
Really you are writing a lot, but I don’t see you having a relationship with God. Because you did not once mention the importance of prayer. God reveals.
(John 3,27) “John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.”
(Mathew 7,8) 8“ “For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.”
This is the Jesus and the teaching that I follow. Your mind will not and can not lead you to the truth. Certain walls of understanding can only be overcome through sincere and direct prayer.
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How do you know that your demonic/holy vision dream was not just a dream induced by your own fanciful thoughts? You make assumptions and then you believe that God has to approve of your assumptions but God is no respecter of persons. You have confirmed your confirmation bias about hell so that clears that up. It doesn’t matter how many lies you believe, how many YouTube videos you watch, or how many dreams you have, you cannot force God into the parameters of your false thinking. Hell is a lie. Period! I’m not discussing hell with you any longer so if you choose to continue believing it’s true, that’s on you but you are not going to change my beliefs when I know it’s a lie.
Are you suggesting that because of Jeremiah 17:9, we shouldn’t search our mind and hearts? Matthew 22:37 says we are to love the Lord God with ALL of our heart and mind so how do you mesh that with what you are implying? The scripture you quoted actually states that the heart is deceitful and WEAK not desperately wicked so it makes sense that a person should search their heart because it is deceitful and weak. Me asking you to search your mind and heart is in no way a contradiction to Jeremiah 17:9. You are making this discussion a battle of biblical wits when that particular comment had nothing to do with theology. I didn’t quote scripture when I told you to search your mind and heart that was my own advice to you. You gave me advice in your previous comment and I didn’t run to the bible to try and use scripture to invalidate your advice. I only use scripture to invalidate your false theology. Cherry picking scriptures that seemingly agree with your point does not make you right so stop doing this because your strategy is flawed.
So you think James 1:5 authorized you to supplant YouTube videos over your duty to study the word of God to show yourself approved? It’s interesting that you just quoted verse 5 without completing the whole thought because there are conditions that must be met before God gives to those who ask… Here is James 1:5-8;
If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him. BUT let him ask in FAITH, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a WAVE OF THE SEA DRIVEN AND TOSSED BY THE WIND (that’s you because you’ll believe anything that tickles your ears). For LET NOT THAT MAN SUPPOSE THAT HE WILL RECEIVE ANYTHING FROM THE LORD; HE IS A DOUBLE-MINDED MAN, UNSTABLE IN ALL HIS WAYS.
This is what you do. You suppose that you will receive from God all while endorsing loads of unscriptural nonsense instead of aligning your faith with truth. Your faith is aligned with the dogmas and traditions of Christianity and that is why you continuously contradict yourself over and over again.
The lake of fire is NOT a place of eternal spiritual death. That is your interpretation, nothing more nothing less. I already explained to you in my previous comment that PROSTITUTES enter the kingdom before self-righteous religions hypocrites and the sexually immoral go to the lake of fire second death. If prostitutes will someday enter the kingdom of God in the future, that alone suggests that the lake of fire is not what you think it is and it is your interpretation that is incorrect. In Revelation 21:8, those who go to the lake of fire will have their part or PORTION so it is definitely not forever as you suggest. I didn’t add anything, I just know how to properly divide the word of truth whereas you multiply it to align with your depraved ideology.
I don’t have to imagine that any of God’s judgment will last forever because they don’t. Your beliefs have no power over me and you can think whatever you want to think. The torment or TESTING does NOT last forever and ever. The phrase “forever and ever” is not scripture even though this phrase can be found in many popular English bibles but bibles are not the word of God. Bibles are TRANSLATIONS of the word of God so if you believe in the translation more than you do the actually words of God, who do you actually believe? You know more believe in God than an atheist and you prove that with every foolish comment that you make. The phrase itself is actually pretty stupid because forever would be sufficient enough to describe no end so it makes no sense to add another ever. Forever and ever was translated from the Greek phrase “eis tous aionas ton aionon” and it literally means, for the ages of ages. As I stated in my previous comment, the best way to learn a words meaning is to study its usage so we have to look at all the instances that this phrase (forever and ever) is found in scripture. Here is an example;
Revelation 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and HE SHALL REIGN FOREVER AND EVER!”
Does Christ reign forever and ever?
1 Corinthians 15:24-25 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to our God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. For He must reign UNTIL He has put all His enemies under His feet.
Do you know what “until” means? Christ doesn’t reign forever and ever, He reigns UNTIL He has put all enemies under His feet. Jesus no longer reigns once He hands over the kingdom to the Father because in verse 28, we are told that even Christ Himself will be in subjection to the Father. Christ reigns for the ages of ages, which essentially means that He reigns until He gets the job done no matter how long it takes. God doesn’t torment or try anyone by the fire for all eternity. That is evil hogwash.
Do you know what refine even means? Frank, I am really trying hard not to insult you but you are just being stupid at this point. You are expecting me to engage in and entertain your stupidity and I simply will not. I will finish this comment but after that, we are done. I cannot continue to entertain your foolishness. It is an oxymoron to suggest that the fire of God’s judgment refines forever because that defeats the entire purpose of what it means to refine. Here are a few definitions of refine;
– to improve or perfect by pruning or polishing
– to bring to a fine or a pure state
– to make or become free from impurities
When you refine something, you make it better. When gold is refined, the gold comes out more pure and shinier. This is common sense elementary logic and you are inventing ideas to support your ridiculous theology. Some of your comments are so stupid that they don’t even deserve a response. I am literally dumbstruck by some of the things you said. You have no clue what you are talking about dude. Not a single CLUE! People have to stay in hell for all eternity to glorify God’s name? That might the most blasphemous thing I’ve ever heard.
You aren’t humble at all. You are an arrogant man that thinks he knows it all but can’t back up a thing with logic or scripture that is divided properly. You think you can use prayer to manipulate God but you are mistaken. You are of the holier-than-thou types that boasts about praying all the time and doing this or that but you have already earned your reward, which is stroking your own ego. Prayer doesn’t give you permission to be lazy and stupid. Waiting for things to be revealed is just your excuse to not have to study or think on your own. You don’t have the truth and that is what you fail to realize because you’re too busy judging others.
I don’t understand where you are coming from because nothing you say makes any sense at all. You are just waves of the sea foaming at the mouth talking complete and utter nonsense. You have not responded to hardly any of the blatant contradictions I called you out on so this discussion is over. You are dishonest and not qualified to deal with these issues.
You think I’m cursed just because I don’t run around telling people to repent? Typical of a self-righteous hypocrite. Jesus was sinless and had every right to call sinners to repentance; you on the other hand with huge beams sticking out of both your eyes has no right trying to tell others to repent. You are a hypocrite of the worst breed.
Like I stated before, you are in no position to cast judgment when you don’t have your own life in order. Of course Jesus was judging the sinner when He told them to repent. What do you think judgment is? The difference here is, YOU’RE NOT JESUS! You’re more closer to the devil than you are Jesus and I willingly accept that judgment of you because you’ve earned it.
“The salvation of all is God’s desire and God proclaims that He will accomplish His every desire.“
Please give me the exact scripture.
Glady!
1 Timothy 2:3-4 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, WHO DESIRES ALL PEOPLE TO BE SAVED and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Isaiah 46:10 At the beginning I declare the outcome; from of old, things not yet done. I say that my plan shall stand, I ACCOMPLISH MY EVERY DESIRE.
Isaiah 55:11 So will My word be which goes out of My mouth; it will not return to Me empty, WITHOUT ACCOMPLISHING WHAT I DESIRE, and without succeeding in the purpose for which I sent it.
Case closed. You will not accept the literal words in these scriptures because they are in conflict with your horrible beliefs. The only thing you can do is lie or either manipulate these scriptures so that they align with your beliefs.
“The only thing you’ve cleared up for me is that you are on another spectrum of deception that I’ve never encountered before“
This is exactly what the Pharasees would say to Jesus, since they said similar things.
Again, you are not Jesus. Deflecting with some hyper-religious comment doesn’t change the fact that you are deceived.
“You have a lot of work to do because you are going to wake up on the wrong side of judgment where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.“
“You could’ve saved me all that reading, and just admit, that you believe in that place”.
Lol, that’s your assumption but you clearly missed the connection which I fully expected you to. I don’t believe in that place like you do because I have enough sense to know that it is evil and stupid but let me share this with you since you think that place is real;
Matthew 8:11-12 And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE KINGDOM SHALL BE CAST OUT INTO OUTER DARKNESS: THERE SHALL BE WEEPING AND GNASHING OF TEETH.
It isn’t the stranger of God that will weep and gnash their teeth, it is THE CHILDREN OF THE KINGDOM and you are of the same spirit as the religious hypocrites casting judgment on your fellow sinners when you yourself have sin and even worse is dooming most of humanity to some pagan hell. When you rise from the dead in the resurrection to judgment seeing that you have missed out from reigning with Christ in the age to come, you will weep and gnash your teeth in utter disgust.
“Really you are writing a lot, but I don’t see you having a relationship with God. Because you did not once mention the importance of prayer”
You talk about prayer a lot yet you don’t have an ounce of understanding so what does that say about your prayers? Boasting about your prayers is hypocritical. My relationship with God is private, it doesn’t include you and I do not need your guidance or approval. You are extremely deceived yet you keep boasting about your prayers? God doesn’t answer the prayers of people who do not even believe what He says. In some cases you don’t even know what He says but you don’t care because you worship your bible translation.
“This is the Jesus and the teaching that I follow. Your mind will not and can not lead you to the truth. Certain walls of understanding can only be overcome through sincere and direct prayer”.
You are not following Jesus; you are following the invention of Jesus you have created in your own mind. You seriously have no idea how wrong you are and it is extremely disturbing but you are far beyond reason at this point. Your supposed “sincere and direct prayer” has done nothing to bring down your walls of misunderstanding so that tells me your prayers are worthless. I’m sure you tell yourself whatever you need to tell yourself to make you feel like you are right but you are only tricking yourself.
Frank, this was interesting but I’m afraid this has to end. Please do not respond or send any future comments because they will not be approved. I have already wasted a significant amount of my time responding to you when you clearly do not want the truth. I cannot waste any more of my time kicking a dead horse. Best wishes to you and I’ll apologize in advance for some of my harsh words but I was merely responding to your commentary. I have no ill will towards you as a person so be well and take care!
Sulaiman
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I don’t care what you advise and I don’t need your warnings. I’m not afraid of you or your message of fear. Your fear mongering will not work on me because I have been delivered from the fear motivated religion you associate yourself with. I asked you not to leave any more comments because I will not approve them and I am standing by what I said. You are dishonest in your scholarship and I cannot dialogue with someone that is as dishonest as you when it comes to studying and discussing scripture. You dismiss the word of God to cling to your theology which is certainly your right to do but I have no duty to obey you or endorse your line of thinking. It’s comical how you think you can use a different translation to dismiss the clear teaching of scripture just to suit your beliefs. I didn’t write scripture but there is a difference in rightly dividing the word of truth and manipulating it to fit your evil narrative. I’ll expand on my previous comment so others can see how to properly exegete scripture instead of twisting the scriptures like you do.
1 Timothy 2:3-4 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, WHO DESIRES ALL PEOPLE TO BE SAVED and to come to the knowledge of the truth. NKJV
The Greek word translated as “desire” in 1 Timothy 2:4 is thelō which is found in the New Testament 210 times. This word can mean all of these things according to how it is used in SCRIPTURE: to will, have in mind, intend, to be resolved or determined, to purpose, to desire, to wish, to love, to like to do a thing, be fond of doing, to take delight in, and to have pleasure in.
Here is Isaiah 46:10 from the ENGLISH translation of the Septuagint that you quoted (with your commentary) since the actual Septuagint is the Greek translation of the Hebrew scriptures;
Isaiah 46:10 says here “Foretelling beforehand the things that were to come before they were done, and when they were accomplished. And I said, All my council is set up, and all that I shall do, I will do.” (differs from your scripture)
I looked up this verse in the Septuagint which is;
ἀναγγέλλων πρότερον τὰ ἔσχατα πρὶν αὐτὰ γενέσθαι, καὶ ἅμα συνετελέσθη. καὶ εἶπα· πᾶσα ἡ βουλή μου στήσεται, καὶ πάντα, ὅσα βεβούλευμαι, ποιήσω
Here is the literal translation of Isaiah 46:10 from the Septuagint;
Foretelling the last things before they come to pass, and if they come to pass. and I said: all my counsel is established, and all that I will, I will do;
Here is Isaiah 46:10 from the New American Bible (Revised Edition) that I quoted;
Isaiah 46:10 At the beginning I declare the outcome; from of old, things not yet done. I say that my plan shall stand, I ACCOMPLISH MY EVERY DESIRE.
The Hebrew word translated as “will” in the Septuagint and “desire” in the New American Bible (Revised Edition) is ḥēp̄eṣ which is found in the Old Testament 39 times. This word can mean all of these things according to how this word is used in SCRIPTURE: delight, pleasure, DESIRE, longing, the good pleasure, that in which one takes delight, and willingly.
So according to the actually meaning of the Hebrew word ḥēp̄eṣ, desire is an appropriate translation but even if we use the word “will”, what does that change? You think God’s desire is in conflict with what He wills to do or accomplish? It doesn’t matter if God desires for all to be saved or if He wills for all to be saved, Isaiah 46:10 in the Septuagint says all that God will do, He will do it. So if He wills for all to be saved, HE WILL DO IT! If He desires for all to be saved, He will accomplish His every desire. The fact that you disagree with what God wills and you don’t share in what He desires does not mean that God can’t or won’t bring about His will or desire.
Let’s try this with Isaiah 55:11;
Here is Isaiah 55:11 from the ENGLISH translation of the Septuagint that you quoted (with your commentary);
Isaiah 55:11 says here “So is my word, that if it go out of my mouth, it shall not be turned away, till I have done all that I have purposed, and have prospered in my ways and in my commandments.” (also no mention of desire)
Here is Isaiah 55:11 from the actual Greek Septuagint and it’s literal translation into English;
οὕτως ἔσται τὸ ρῆμά μου, ὃ ἐὰν ἐξέλθῃ ἐκ τοῦ στόματός μου, οὐ μὴ ἀποστραφῇ, ἕως ἂν τελεσθῇ ὅσα ἂν ἠθέλησα καὶ εὐοδώσω τὰς ὁδούς μου καὶ τὰ ἐντάλματά μου.
Thus is my word, which, if it goes forth from my mouth, will not be turned back, until all that I willed is accomplished and I make my ways and my commandments successful.
Here is Isaiah 55:11 from the New American Standard Bible that I quoted;
Isaiah 55:11 So will My word be which goes out of My mouth; it will not return to Me empty, WITHOUT ACCOMPLISHING WHAT I DESIRE, and without succeeding in the purpose for which I sent it.
The Hebrew word translated as “purposed and/or willed” in the Septuagint and “desire” in the New American Standard Bible is ḥāp̄ēṣ and this word is found 75 times in the Old Testament. This word can mean all of these things according to how this word is used in SCRIPTURE: to delight in, take pleasure in, DESIRE, be pleased with, to take pleasure in, delight in, be pleased to do of God, and to will.
So here again, the word desire is an appropriate translation of the Hebrew word ḥāp̄ēṣ but just like I stated before, none of these characteristics of God change anything. It doesn’t matter if it’s His desire, His delight, His will, His purpose, His wishes, His dreams, His whatever word you want to use…. None of these characteristics contradict each other. You have failed to properly read the actual scripture. I will quote Isaiah 55:11 using the words of the Septuagint that you provided and still show you how you have failed in your understanding;
Isaiah 55:11 says here “So is my word, that if it go out of my mouth, it shall not be turned away, till I have done all that I have purposed, and have prospered in my ways and in my commandments.”
Let’s examine this scripture for a minute… God says, “So is my WORD, that if it go out of my mouth, it shall not be turned away…. but isn’t 1 Timothy 2:3-4 God’s word? This is God’s word and it came out of His mouth;
1 Timothy 2:3-4 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, WHO DESIRES ALL PEOPLE TO BE SAVED and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
I already demonstrated that the word desire is appropriate in this context so we can clearly read here what God has spoken and He declares that what He speaks “shall not be turned away”. So God’s desire for all to be saved and to come to the knowledge of truth will not be turned away regardless of the people who trample the word of God. God’s word that comes out of His mouth will not be turned away until He has done ALL that He has willed, purposed, desired, wished, etc… and have prospered in His ways and in His commandments. You can try to argue that the word desire isn’t in the scripture but you fail to realize that you have to do this in order to keep believing what you believe. You cannot continue to believe what you believe and also accept the truth of God’s word but that clearly tells me and everyone that you are not a follower of God. The primary point of Isaiah 55:11 is not whether the word desire is appropriate or not, the point is that God’s word will not return to Him void without accomplishing what He has spoken. If you are blasphemous enough to suggest that God cannot accomplish what He desires, then I think the conclusion is clear as to what you stand for.
I know what the children of the kingdom represents but they aren’t doomed as you suggest. The Apostle Paul said in Romans 11:26 that ALL of Israel will be saved so that’s just further proof that you don’t know what you’re talking about.
I never said prayer wasn’t essential and I never said it didn’t work but it’s not meant to be abused in the way that you use prayer. You think you can pray to God and get what you want but you haven’t even followed the basics of truth. You believe a load of religious nonsense but you think God approves of and authorizes such nonsense just because you prayed? People like you use prayer to keep God in a bubble that you can control but God doesn’t live inside your bubble and He cannot be manipulated. You remind me of that lunatic Bill Wiese who claims he had a dream about hell then he proceeds to write a book full of unscriptural nonsense. I’m sure he believes that God authorized that garbage but he is deceived just as much as you are. I’m not upset because I have no reason to be upset. You only think I am because I’m criticizing you and I’m challenging your ungodly beliefs. What do you think I’m doing? Screaming as a type? I take my ministry seriously and I devote countless hours to talk to complete strangers for free but I do not have the time to keep wasting it on someone that doesn’t deserve it. I don’t care about what you pray about. You can’t manipulate me with your silly prayers and I don’t have to agree with you. You think just because you say “VERY VERY” that’s supposed to change anything? You are deceived Frank and there is nothing I can do about that. You don’t believe God will save all because you don’t want God to save all.
The story of the rich man and Lazarus is a PARABLE and I have already written about this so I don’t care what you have to say about this. Just because you don’t understand something doesn’t mean I’m wrong. You don’t understand how God accomplishes His desire to save all and you understand very little about Christian Universalism. Everything you said about Christian Universalism is wrong and I do not endorse any of what you said. Many are called, but few are chosen. That is probably the most misunderstood scripture in the entire bible. I preach nothing about a purgatory so there’s yet another lie that’s on you and all liars go to the lake of fire second death.
You put NO FEAR in me. Not a smidgeon. The only thing you’ve done is made me pity you for being so deceived. There are many things that I need to change in my life, but belief in hell isn’t one of them. I used to believe in hell but that was when I was ignorant letting the church think for me until I decided to actually research these topics and I discovered for myself that hell is a lie. Hell has only ever been used by the church to control the masses of people with fear. Any relationship based on carnal fear is not a healthy relationship and this is certainly not what the Creator wants for His creation of whom He is creating in His very image. I know you think that hell is real and it’s something I shouldn’t dismiss but I completely dismiss your pagan hell and I’m completely dismissing you.
You are banned. There will be no future dialogue between us. Have a nice day
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